BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

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Hurtzberg
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BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Hurtzberg »

Hello All,

In order to not completely de-rail Countryboy's blog, I thought I'd continue the discussion of using a bike engine here.

The main issue I see with most bike engines is they need to use their own gearbox which leads to a problem with positioning.

On a bike the engine is across the frame with the output sprocket towards the back of one side of the engine. When the engine is turned 90 degrees, this would mean that the output shaft either has to be very out of line from the diff or most of the engine and certainly the exhaust manifold needs to be in the wheel arch.

Do you clever people know a way around that alignment issue to avoid the need to lose the near side corner of the car?

Cheers :cheers:
Andrew

1957 A35
Big Daddy
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Hurtzberg wrote:On a bike the engine is across the frame with the output sprocket towards the back of one side of the engine. When the engine is turned 90 degrees...
BMW K-series engine runs longitudinally with shaft drive to the rear wheel... :thumbs:
BMW Compact-Drive-system-of-K-Series.jpg
BMW Compact-Drive-system-of-K-Series.jpg (67.36 KiB) Viewed 1654 times
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Hurtzberg
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Hurtzberg »

Has anyone got the dimensions of that ?

Still looks like you'll have a problem with the output being off centre and the exhaust manifold exiting through the chassis rail .
Andrew

1957 A35
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Unless installed in an Imp or Davrian, the BMW engine would be rotated 90 deg to a conventional upright position for a car. Obvious issue is oil flow control which is why I asked that question on CB's thread. Concern about engine mounts has been expressed but that's relatively easy to solve.

Big advantage of complete BMW engine is that it's a fully developed, signed-off and proven package unlike some A-series concoctions with their inherent problems. Also it's light weight, small, powerful and cheap so ideally suited to A30/A35... :thumbs:
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Dave Clark
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Dave Clark »

And with a nice little IHI turbo could be a lot of fun.
Big Daddy
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Dave Clark wrote:And with a nice little IHI turbo could be a lot of fun.
Which would blow my fully developed, signed-off and proven package advantage out of the window, probably quite literally... :shock:

If you want more torque, bigger is still better. This discussion is at risk of going full circle... :whistle:
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Brummie.Steve
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Brummie.Steve »

how about a triumph rocket 3 engine
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Hurtzberg
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Hurtzberg »

BD, even rotated, the output shaft is in the wrong place.

What I'm asking is does it have to be central or is there an easy way around this?

Making it central by moving the engine to one side would still make the manifold go through the arch.
Andrew

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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Brummie.Steve wrote:how about a triumph rocket 3 engine
For an A35 or a dumper truck :?: ... :mrgreen:
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OVY871
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by OVY871 »

If I remember rightly a few years ago there was a Honda V4 from a Pan European in an A30. Quite liked it as it looked like a scaled down American engine :D
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Big Daddy
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Hurtzberg wrote:What I'm asking is does it have to be central or is there an easy way around this?
Thought we were reviewing engine installation. But you seem to have included the transmission even without any reverse gear. Engine has a conventional crankshaft position.
BMW K-Series.jpg
BMW K-Series.jpg (53.96 KiB) Viewed 1604 times
Hurtzberg wrote:Making it central by moving the engine to one side would still make the manifold go through the arch.
Angle it across the engine bay if you want and correct misalignment with propshaft UJs (within limits).

But I don't understand how you can make any judgement on potential issues without even knowing critical dimensions and undertaking a rudimentary package study. You're cleverer than me Gunga Din... :bow:

Finally as I've said many times, unless capacity constrained for some reason (even whim and fancy), there are more suitable, easier to install and cheaper engines than K1200RS or almost any bike engine... :whistle:
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Hurtzberg
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Hurtzberg »

Big Daddy wrote:
BMW K-series engine runs longitudinally with shaft drive to the rear wheel... :thumbs:
BMW Compact-Drive-system-of-K-Series.jpg
Big Daddy wrote: Thought we were reviewing engine installation. But you seem to have included the transmission even without any reverse gear.
Hahaha, you might want to remind yourself about that.

People have tried to mate the Hayabusa engine to normal car gearboxes and find that there is a lot of issues. It might have been with balance but it was a co up le of years ago. You can Google it to see a very interesting build that ultimately failed. I'm making the assumption this is true for most/all bike engines.

Reverse gear is no problem. Plenty of solutions for that in the kit car world. Quaiffe even do one for less than a grand if you want to go posh.

If you'd prefer me to write the question like this, I am happy to :

BD, assuming you need to keep the engine central or even move it to the drivers side to have good routing for the exhaust, how would you go about getting the off centre output from the bike gearbox to the car diff?
Andrew

1957 A35
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Big Daddy »

Hurtzberg wrote:Hahaha, you might want to remind yourself about that.
My comment was in response to your statement: "On a bike the engine is across the frame with the output sprocket towards the back of one side of the engine" which simply isn't true for a BMW K-series.

Hurtzberg wrote:If you'd prefer me to write the question like this, I am happy to :
BD, assuming you need to keep the engine central or even move it to the drivers side to have good routing for the exhaust, how would you go about getting the off centre output from the bike gearbox to the car diff?
Write the question any way you like - my answer will be the same. Without detailed component dimensions and going through at least a rudimentary package study, I don't know.

But what I do know is that if presented with the challenge of fitting a BMW K-series engine (with or without bike transmission and even with Quaife reverse gearbox), we would develop a satisfactory installation. It's not rocket science. By why anyone would go to all this effort but still be constrained by 1200cc or even 1300cc when there are much better options available, is beyond me... :whistle:

Much more of this and I will lose the will to live... :roll:
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by gazza82 »

On fleabay now ...
Tl1000r motor with loom, ecu, injectors etc. I've had this engine for nearly 2 years sat in the garage. I heard it run before I purchased it but I haven't ran it up since. It's been prop converted and comes with Westfield reverse gearbox, all ready to drop into a kit car or classic car upgrade like I intended to. We did start fitting it into an Austin A30 but along came an s2000 at the right money so have now gone for that instead. Would make a really mean sounding lowcost or Westfield etc. I have advertised this elsewhere so reserve the right to end this early. Advertising this at a fraction of what it cost me.
Starting bids at £600

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/272588830950
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Cars: "Project 757" '59 A35 2-door bought in 1971 & Subaru BRZ SE LUX Auto plus "family fleet": Alfa MiTo, Peugeot 206, (Ex '98 Alfa Romeo 156 2.0 TS)
Hurtzberg
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Re: BMW k1200rs or other bike engines

Post by Hurtzberg »

gazza82 wrote:On fleabay now ...

Starting bids at £600

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/272588830950
Basil Fawlty wrote: Don't mention the output shaft is off centre. I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it all right.


Ovy, I remember the Pan engined car on ebay, looked really cool.
Andrew

1957 A35
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